Joe: 00:15

Welcome back to another episode of the Freedom Talks podcast, everybody. This is your host, Joe Ogden, and we are sitting down with one of our new therapists that was just hired here at Freedom Physical Therapy. He is a recent new grad and new to the physical therapy profession. So we're super excited to have doctor Jacob Boucher join us here at Freedom. Jacob, welcome.

Jacob: 00:39

Thanks for having me, Joe.

Joe: 00:41

Jacob kinda got suckered into just doing a podcast right away. He didn't really say yes. I just scheduled it for him. But so, obviously, thank you for just sitting down and doing this with us.

Jacob: 00:53

Yeah. No problem.

Joe: 00:55

A really good opportunity, I think, one for us at Freedom. I mean, we've got a really good group of of therapists here as as well as a lot of great new therapists that we're hiring on. So it's really fun for me doing this podcast just to kinda sit down and and get to know them a little bit, as well as listeners who are looking for a physical therapist or potentially will see our new therapist that we hire. I think this is just a good opportunity to just kinda get to know you a little bit, Jacob, and, you know, kinda go from there.

Jacob: 01:24

Alright. Sounds good.

Joe: 01:25

So let's start with just kind of the basic demographics, Jacob. Where are you from? Where'd you go to PT school? Where'd you go to college? Let's start there.

Joe: 01:33

Let's take it back to the beginning here.

Jacob: 01:34

Alright. So I was born and raised Mukwonago, Wisconsin. Went to high school Mukwonago. Played football and track there.

Joe: 01:41

Go Indians.

Jacob: 01:42

Yeah. Yeah. They they they're the Indians. And then went to undergrad at Carthage College in Kenosha.

Joe: 01:49

Go Redbirds.

Jacob: 01:50

Yes. Firebirds, actually.

Joe: 01:53

Oh, Firebirds. Excuse me.

Jacob: 01:54

Excuse It used to be the Redman, and then it got changed to Firebirds, but they did.

Joe: 01:57

Was it a was Redman a native? Was it the native American?

Jacob: 02:00

Then they pushed away from it to, like, have, like, a space between the names, so it was, like, Redman and but, they changed it to Firebirds. And, honestly, they did a really good job with it. They let the student body, like, kinda vote on it.

Joe: 02:11

Oh, really?

Jacob: 02:11

And then the the design is actually really cool.

Joe: 02:14

Because they were using the sea a lot for their

Jacob: 02:16

Yeah. The c shield.

Joe: 02:17

Kinda like Carroll was doing that too with the Pioneer.

Jacob: 02:19

Yeah. So but, they did a good job rebranding it, and and Firebirds is now is now the mascot. So it's it's cool. But, I went to undergrad, Carthage College, played football there, but did track for a year, and then was in the athletic training program there. And then I went to PT school at St.

Jacob: 02:40

Ambrose down in Davenport, Iowa, and now I'm here. So yeah.

Joe: 02:44

So you're you did your four year AT and then did three year

Jacob: 02:49

Yep.

Joe: 02:50

Three year PT school?

Jacob: 02:51

Yep. St. Ambrose is a two and a half year program, so that was nice. That's part of the reasons why I chose them. So it's a little bit little bit quicker, a little bit cheaper.

Joe: 02:57

What do they skip or not skip out on, but how do they get from three to two and

Jacob: 03:00

I think they do more scheduling, like, in the summer, so we don't have as long as breaks. And I think I don't know if we take more credits during each semester, but, they still get all the clinics in and everything. So they do a good job. They have a really nice program there. And they're one of the first PT programs to do two and a half years.

Jacob: 03:19

So they have

Joe: 03:19

I think that's becoming the new trend. I think someone said Milwaukee's doing that now.

Jacob: 03:22

Yeah. Yeah. They they debated going back to three for a little bit just because they got spooked, I think, during COVID with, like, the pass rates dropping.

Joe: 03:30

For the board exam?

Jacob: 03:31

Yeah. So they got spooked and thought it was because of the two and a half year program, but now scores are coming back up. So I think it's just the the COVID slump, unfortunately. So

Joe: 03:40

Interesting. I wonder why they think going for three years is gonna make board exam scores go higher.

Jacob: 03:44

I I don't know. But, no, they have a good program, two and a half years. So went there, now now I'm here. So

Joe: 03:52

What what got you interested in PT?

Jacob: 03:55

Coming out of high school, I wanted to I think this is the same journey almost every PT does. They, wanna work with athletes. They wanna be active. They wanna they're interested in exercise. So, I wanted to do a profession with that.

Jacob: 04:10

So going to Carthage, they didn't have a PT program. So within the first year, freshman year of Carthage, I knew I wanted to do more physical therapy, but they didn't have the program. So I thought athletic training would be a great bridge between getting me prepared, seeing athletes, seeing hands on patients, getting clinical experience to get into PT school later on. So I actually really enjoyed athletic training as well. I liked working on the field with them.

Jacob: 04:37

I liked, being able to diagnose the injuries and then kind of build up their rehab back to return to sport. So, that kind of helped me assure my assure my path that I wanted to be a physical therapist because the rehab part of it was was really fun and, you know, learning how the body moves and optimizing the best movements to to get them the best out of the athletes. So Did you

Joe: 04:57

think PT school was easier because you already had your AT?

Jacob: 05:00

For the first year, yes. Just because I already had hands on experience. You know, I already learned how to use a goniometer. I know all the muscle test, the concave convex rule, all that stuff was kind of introduced to me in athletic training. So so I like to think it helped me for sure.

Joe: 05:18

Where is the line of, like and I feel like this is just, like, OT, PT, AT in general, like, we overlap so much. But like for you already having the AT curriculum, so to speak Mhmm. Which that one and aren't they going to a doctorate now too?

Jacob: 05:34

They're masters now. So I was the second to last year where it was a bachelor's So I wouldn't have done it if it was master's.

Joe: 05:39

Where the bachelor's is like and that's what PT used to be.

Jacob: 05:41

Yeah.

Joe: 05:43

And this could be a different debate. I I try not to talk about this too much, but PT used to be, which is what AT, I guess, used to be now at this point too. Like, here's your four years. Get your stuff done. This is all the stuff.

Joe: 05:55

Yep. What point in PT school is like, okay. Now the line, we have crossed the sand, the line in the sand to this is now PT, new stuff for me.

Jacob: 06:04

Yeah. I'd say the more the manual stuff was a big change for me. I felt like athletic training was more exercise based, soft tissue modalities versus in PT school, we were very hands on, like, breaking down the each joint and, you know, the convex concave rule with, like, which way they it should glide, which way it should roll, and using more anatomy to treat versus just exercise with athletic training. In athletic training, I also focused a lot on, like, emergency scenarios, more pathology, like, that's that different pathologies versus

Joe: 06:41

So, like, ortho was probably easy.

Jacob: 06:43

Yeah. I'd I'd yeah. For sure. And cardio palm was pretty lot of review with that for cardio Palm too just in terms of, like, you know, like, VO two max and all that stuff. So yeah.

Joe: 06:57

What about all, like, the conditions?

Jacob: 07:00

In terms of what?

Joe: 07:01

Like, I come in with chest pain. It could be, you know, all this different thing besides a heart attack.

Jacob: 07:07

Yeah. That that was another adjustment because with athletic training, you're focused more on just high school and college athletes. Right. So you're not thinking about those pathologies that affect the older population. Yeah.

Jacob: 07:18

So that was that was a little bit of a change, but, like, you know, like, cor pulmonale and like, corpus callosum, like high impact injuries, like all that stuff we already learned about, so that was a good review too. Okay. Yeah.

Joe: 07:31

Tell us a little bit about your, your clinical rotations with PT school. What are your experiences like?

Jacob: 07:36

I had, so St. Ambrose does three, three week clinicals kind of through space throughout the school curriculum. And then we finish with three, long term clinicals, two eight weeks and a ten week. My first one was right after the first semester of PT school, and it was in the hospital, just general acute care, so we were kind of bouncing around each floor. And that one was a good kind of intro because going into PT school, I never realized PTs can be in hospitals.

Jacob: 08:04

I knew that they were that they had a right wide range of settings, but I guess I didn't realize that it was that big of a setting, like, that they can be in. So that was a good one to kinda get introduced to. And then I had a short term outpatient up in Door County where I saw a lot of total joints and post op surgeries. And then my last short term was in Knoxville at an outpatient clinic, where the manager did a lot of running and worked with a lot of runners in the community, so they had a lot of like, an anti gravity treadmill and a lot of running programs going on, so that was cool. And then I had an eight week at an outpatient down in Iowa, and that one was more hands on.

Jacob: 08:44

My CI was OCS certified, so he did a lot of hands on stuff and made Linn Mulligans, all that stuff. And then second to last eight week was in the ICU in South Dakota. So that was fun to see a lot of stuff with the ICU. We did a lot of mechanical vent walking post, like, you know, type of surgery imaginable we saw. So that was really, really interesting to see.

Jacob: 09:11

And then the last one was outpatient neuro in Brookfield at Ascension, where my CI was vestibular, headache, concussion, stroke, SCI, all that stuff. So, yeah, had a wide range of stuff.

Joe: 09:24

So pretty intensive, your last one.

Jacob: 09:25

Yeah. It was it was a ten week one, so it was it was I'm glad I had it before right before the boards, though, because it was a lot of good review, and neuro tends to be a topic that a lot of people struggle with. So so to be able to have that and see all that stuff was was really helpful.

Joe: 09:40

So did you know, like, once you were done with PT school that you come back to this area since you're from this area?

Jacob: 09:45

Yeah. I kind of figured I wanted to come back to Wisconsin.

Joe: 09:52

Yeah. So now you're here. Did you apply at other places? Or how's the not even that. Not even that.

Joe: 09:58

Let let's reframe that a little bit. How did you think the the the job market was coming back? Like, what was your, you know, application process like, your interview process like? Yeah. Talk us through that a little bit.

Jacob: 10:10

There was I mean, there was there's a there's a lot of openings, obviously, outpatient, and there were some openings for, like, more PRN stuff or, like, part time positions.

Joe: 10:19

PRN is crazy right now.

Jacob: 10:21

Yeah. Especially with in the hospital. And I did not wanna start PR, and I wanna start full time. So and I knew I wanted to be outpatient, and there was there was a good selection. I'd say, honestly, the Midwest is has really good outpatient clinics between, like, you know, Rock Valley and Iowa and then up here in Freedom with in terms of, like, not double booking or anything like that.

Jacob: 10:41

So I was looking for a job that didn't double book and was a little bit smaller community. I didn't want the national companies in terms of, like, double and triple bookings. So I tried to look for more jobs that had one on one with patients because that provides the best care for them. So it there was there was a lot of there was some good openings, but I applied to Freedom for the Mukwonago location, and then I was phone interviewed and then had an in person interview with Scott and Mike, the owner. And then they got back to me pretty quickly about, you know, getting an offer in, so that's kind of my course.

Jacob: 11:17

Yeah.

Joe: 11:18

Did you interview other places? Nope. So just one?

Jacob: 11:20

Yeah. Just one. Just at the start and it worked out, so I didn't feel like I needed to. I technically applied for more jobs, but

Joe: 11:28

Didn't hear back?

Jacob: 11:29

Or I just didn't even look. I haven't looked at my Indeed since then.

Joe: 11:32

So Is that how you found it? Was Indeed? Yeah. Yep. So yeah.

Joe: 11:36

So this being your first job and you got it pretty quickly Yeah. You know, what are what would you say, like, for even someone who's a new grad that might be listening, who's looking at especially graduating May. Mhmm. Obviously, May is a big college graduation time. Yeah.

Joe: 11:48

Like, what would be some advice or a piece of advice that you would give someone who is looking at jobs and going through the interview process? Like, what what drew you to Freedom or what are some of the things that you value in the job? I know you mentioned one on one treatment. Is there anything else that you also value?

Jacob: 12:03

Continuing Ed. Freedom does a good job of, you know, providing a ton of resources to to continue your education. They reimburse. So that was another big one because I know we've kind of talked about it already, but, like, continuing to end is how you find your treatment and how you find your kind of philosophy with treatments. So to have a company that supports that is huge in developing as a professional.

Jacob: 12:27

That's another thing too. Then, obviously, you know, being having the owner available to talk to, like, that's huge too. It's not there's no, like, gap between corporate and and PTs. Like, there's it's very it's a very tight knit group of PTs. So.

Joe: 12:49

Yeah. And I I'd be curious, you know, truly what the other clinics say. I think we're a little spoiled here in Fox Point with that. Right? Because

Jacob: 12:56

Yeah.

Joe: 12:57

You know, our owner does come here, Mike, pretty routinely. So, you know, we do see him. But he does get around in the other clinics and stuff. But I think that's something that is unique about Freedom that Yeah. Mike is here routinely and, you know Mhmm.

Joe: 13:12

We'll find out about, you know, good and bad pretty quickly.

Jacob: 13:15

Yeah. Right.

Joe: 13:16

And I know we talked about this a little bit. This is a good segue too. We talked a little bit yesterday and this week about continuing ed. It's hard, I think, as a new grad

Jacob: 13:25

Mhmm.

Joe: 13:26

Because there's so much that's thrown at you. Right?

Jacob: 13:28

Yeah. Right.

Joe: 13:28

You know, do this, do this, do this, do this, do this. What are some of the things that you're already kind of drawn to as far as, you know, your treatment style, what things that you really like to look for, things you like, you know, addressing with a lot of people? Yeah.

Jacob: 13:42

I like obviously being hands on. I think there's a it's it's very beneficial to be hands on with a patient because you get to feel, what's going on, and they get to feel have that proprioception with the hands on as well. And then also doing those hands on techniques and then having an exercise to follow-up it so it sticks. So you're not just doing hands on and then they go home and they lose whatever you just worked on. You wanna have an exercise to follow-up with and make sure that the patients are doing their part at home to get better.

Jacob: 14:20

I said something else, but I forgot.

Joe: 14:30

It's alright. It'll come

Jacob: 14:30

back. That'll come back.

Joe: 14:31

It'll come So and you're at two two clinics. Right? So you're between Fox Point and Grafton, and and and both, I think, just have the different vibes to it. Yeah. And that's not good or bad on either our part or Grafton's part.

Joe: 14:44

I just think different communities, different demographics, different leadership styles, right, which is all all great. There's no one way to do it. You Mike Verplancki is one of my favorite human beings in this company. Yeah. What are some of the things, you know, as far as the the patients that you're seeing already?

Joe: 15:03

What are some common themes that you're seeing where you're kind of seeing your treatment style kind of evolve and be like, okay, this is something that I really like doing.

Jacob: 15:10

Yeah. Education is a big one. That's something you don't really think of coming out of school is educating the patient. You just want to find the answer and get do your hands on stuff and then give them exercise and go, just sitting and talking to the patient is incredibly valuable to them. And I feel like PTs have a, are in a unique position where they can spend a lot of time with their patients and be able to just talk with them and educate them and tell them what's going on versus having a ten minute treatment and not being able to truly elaborate on what's going on.

Jacob: 15:42

So I'd say making sure I educate the patient and fine tuning that and getting the wording out and making sure that they understand kind of what what the goal of PT is. So that's you know?

Joe: 15:55

Are you already starting to look at continuing ed? Yes. I know we talked about this a little bit, but what are some of the things, you know, whether it's company, treatment style, you know, kinda realm of continuing ed? Like, what are some of the things that kinda are drawing your interest right now?

Jacob: 16:11

More like I would say more like like I was looking at the barbell rehab and having more of, like, functional exercise and strength exercises to give patients and and critique patients on and give them techniques to do because, you know, there's I follow so many influencers on, like, Instagram and, like, all these coaches and PTs on Instagram to and they really preach, like, you know, you wanna be you want your patients to work out, but you want them to enjoy it too. So finding what works best for that patient and getting them to do it more at home and on their own because a healthy lifestyle is an active one. So as as well as, you know, nutrition and all that too. So so looking at, you know, barbell training, dumbbell training, different exercise, stuff like that, I think, is what I'm really looking at too now. So

Joe: 16:56

I don't know a ton about that. I mean, I've seen it, but I've never really, like, looked into it. Is it essentially? No. I don't wanna anybody's listening that has the barbell certification.

Joe: 17:05

I'm not trying to talk down on it by any means. I'm sure there's more to it. But is it essentially everything involved in how to modify barbell movements so you can keep doing them?

Jacob: 17:12

Yes. Yes. It's it you don't want their their philosophy is you don't wanna stop because there's pain. Let's modify it so you can keep doing it. And it'd be honestly, it'd be good just to see, like, you know, different teaching cues or just techniques in general.

Jacob: 17:26

It doesn't have to be just barbell. Like, you can you can translate that over to any exercise or any teaching teaching style. So it's something I enjoy. I like to lift. I like to lift heavy, like, lift light.

Jacob: 17:37

So so just, you know, learning more about it is is would be fun.

Joe: 17:42

I think that sounds good. Mean, there's so much out there now, I think, too, which is good. I know some people will disagree with this and that's fine. It doesn't bother me. I just think there's so much to be learned out there online where it's so good to get just like this base knowledge where then the in person is great for, you know, this is how you apply this piece of paper that we just talked about for a week

Jacob: 18:05

Right.

Joe: 18:05

Into practicum purpose. I think now this post COVID era, now that we're settled into this post COVID era, there is so much out there Mhmm. That is one free. Yeah. And two, pay a little bit of money and you get this in-depth Right.

Joe: 18:20

Education like that certification I showed you yesterday.

Jacob: 18:23

Yeah. Yeah.

Joe: 18:23

And I think that's like the 200 page man.

Jacob: 18:25

Yeah. And I I think in person is nice, like you said, to for hands on and practicing the techniques so you can feel what it feels like. It's kinda like in PT school. Like, we have all the techniques practiced on us because we wanna we wanna know what it feels like when we're doing it on patients. So kind of doing that with continuing ed too makes total sense to me.

Jacob: 18:42

And you wanna practice what you preach too. So yeah.

Joe: 18:45

What would you say, like again, I know this is hard as a new grad, especially when, you know, you're trying to get your schedule filled. Beggars can't be choosers. You know, as far as, you know, I really like working with this. What is like a patient demographic that you really enjoy working with or something that you wanna even, you know, kind of evolve and get to?

Jacob: 19:03

I mean, I've always been fascinated by powerlifters and bodybuilders. On my clinicals, we've had I've worked with a few bodybuilders and powerlifters, and they were some of the funnest patients I've ever had just because they already know so much. They're they they know a lot about lifting, about techniques, about modifying, about anatomy. So to be able to kinda just, like, talk shot with them and and push them in the clinic was really, really cool. And, you know, be able to modify stuff so that they can still do what they like as well.

Jacob: 19:32

That that's a really nice population I like to work with.

Joe: 19:35

Yeah. I think the interesting part about these different niches, so to speak, that I'd be curious what you have to say about this actually. So let's let's take the the bodybuilding

Jacob: 19:47

Yeah.

Joe: 19:47

Realm for instance. Yes. I think any physical therapist could get them better.

Jacob: 19:52

Yeah.

Joe: 19:54

At what point do you need to know about the intricacies of that realm to get them better?

Jacob: 20:02

There's a lot of nutrition involved with bodybuilding. It's it's absolutely insane. So my girlfriend's a bodybuilder And

Joe: 20:09

Play a real bodybuilder?

Jacob: 20:10

She's done two shows. Yeah. So, but the nutrition involved is absolutely mind boggling how much they they need to, you know, track calories, track, protein and all that.

Joe: 20:26

So That's a PT bodybuilder. He's a friend of mine.

Jacob: 20:28

Okay.

Joe: 20:28

You should follow him.

Jacob: 20:29

I should. Yeah. And it's it's insane how much and, you know, you want the full you want exercises to have a lot of stretch in the muscle. That's how kind of how you build that muscle and show it. So to be able to modify stuff so you do get the the optimal stretching with the exercises is, I think, important

Joe: 20:48

to I think some of these niches too, and and but you see this firsthand with your girlfriend. Right?

Jacob: 20:52

Yeah.

Joe: 20:54

There becomes at a certain point a huge what would be the right way to say it? Not not burden, but need to really understand the different levels of depth of Mhmm. What someone's problem could be.

Jacob: 21:12

Right.

Joe: 21:12

Like bodybuilder for instance. They're coming in. If someone comes in and says, you know, every time I squat heavy or I do a lying leg curl

Jacob: 21:22

Mhmm.

Joe: 21:22

My hamstrings cramp. As a general PT, what would be the first thing you'd probably jump to when a muscle cramps all the time?

Jacob: 21:30

Could be new hydration, nutrition, or just muscle weakness.

Joe: 21:36

Muscle weakness. Right? Yeah. Muscle weakness or hydration. Like, those are two low hanging fruits.

Joe: 21:41

Right?

Jacob: 21:42

Right.

Joe: 21:42

But then you start diving deeper and, okay, we gotta look at the movement and understand, like, how are you doing this? Like, what's your queuing? Mhmm. Like, it may just be we gotta add in this this, you know, specific hamstring target or in a certain position.

Jacob: 21:53

Right.

Joe: 21:54

Or they're cramping because they're in a they're in a cut right now.

Jacob: 21:57

Yeah. Right.

Joe: 21:58

Right. Like, I think that's where some of those different niches, like, really gotta know. Yeah. The in-depth part of it versus just being, know, kind of a general PT. So I think diving deep into a a niche, not just treatment style, but an actual demographic of niche is awesome.

Jacob: 22:11

Yeah. Whatever you think

Joe: 22:12

is Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely.

Jacob: 22:14

And I feel like a lot of times whenever I follow, you know, people that specialize in certain things or have niches, they they kind of develop their own way of thinking or they don't they don't technically follow, like, a book. They they have their own theories and their own philosophies. So being able to develop that too is also huge.

Joe: 22:31

That sort of thing is wild about the bodybuilding industry. They're there. Like, I used to be big into it and, like, following everybody. Yeah. And this was at the time because how old are you?

Joe: 22:40

24?

Jacob: 22:40

20 five.

Joe: 22:40

20 five. So I'm 27. So we're, like, same demographic.

Jacob: 22:44

Yep.

Joe: 22:44

In college, like, the big people, like now I feel like the bodybuilding world is kinda not shrunken a little bit, but it's evolved to this hybrid training Mhmm. Style where that wasn't a thing. It was, like, bodybuilding or nothing. Like, do you know who Rich Piana is? Have you

Jacob: 23:01

ever heard? Sounds familiar.

Joe: 23:02

So he's a guy who died. There's another another guy who died. There's another guy who was, like, our age who died because he was doing steroids.

Jacob: 23:09

Yeah. A chick just passed away at the Arnold, I think, too.

Joe: 23:11

So Just shocking. Yeah. But all these different guys, like, I remember growing up following Arnold

Jacob: 23:20

Yeah.

Joe: 23:20

Dorian Yates. The first program I ever purchased rose from Kalim von Moger.

Jacob: 23:26

Okay. Nice.

Joe: 23:27

Like Yeah. All these guys are just huge big dudes, but they all have different ways of doing it. Like, Dorian Yates is fascinating to listen to. I don't know if you're familiar with him at all.

Jacob: 23:36

Not not really.

Joe: 23:36

No. So, like, if you pick the bench press, his big thing was you one extra one set. That's it.

Jacob: 23:41

Okay.

Joe: 23:42

And you train every muscle three days a week or excuse me. You only train three days a

Jacob: 23:46

week. Yeah.

Joe: 23:47

Especially as a natural person because you don't have enough testosterone to

Jacob: 23:50

Right.

Joe: 23:51

Recover.

Jacob: 23:51

Right.

Joe: 23:52

There's not another there isn't a single bodybuilder really that's doing that.

Jacob: 23:56

Yeah.

Joe: 23:56

Or has done that since.

Jacob: 23:57

Right.

Joe: 23:57

Then you look at Ronnie Coleman, Jay Cutler. Right?

Jacob: 23:59

Yeah.

Joe: 24:00

All those guys have different ways of doing it Mhmm. Which I think I think is fascinating listening to.

Jacob: 24:05

Jay Cutler is a beast too and Ronnie Coleman. They're all cool. But have you followed Sam Selleck at all? He's

Joe: 24:13

it's He's a

Jacob: 24:14

it's fascinating to watch him because he's his own coach. So every

Joe: 24:17

Oh, is he?

Jacob: 24:17

Everything he's doing is on his own. He he

Joe: 24:20

Oh, I didn't know that.

Jacob: 24:20

He doesn't have a trainer or a coach or anything.

Joe: 24:22

So I actually didn't know that. He's a what I really like about Sam, and I've only seen limited stuff of him. I haven't

Jacob: 24:30

I watch his

Joe: 24:31

videos every once in a while. And I think this applies to PT a lot. I feel like, you know, when I come to you and I say, Jacob, you know, what's the best exercise for, you know, hamstring pain? Every a lot of PT's are type a people. Mhmm.

Joe: 24:48

Give me this cookie cutter approach on how to get to Yeah. Get over here.

Jacob: 24:51

Yeah.

Joe: 24:52

It doesn't work like that.

Jacob: 24:54

That's how I thought it was when I first started school. I wanted to, like, have an answer for everything.

Joe: 24:58

That's how I

Jacob: 24:59

was program. And, you know, our our musculoskeletal teacher did a good job of saying no. That's not how it is. So It's not. So she prepared us well for that.

Jacob: 25:07

But.

Joe: 25:07

And I think the cliche answer, and I I dove deeper onto this one lately, you know, if I, you know, if I ask you again or you ask me what's the best hamstring exercise? And I say it depends, that's equally as bad of an answer. Yeah. That's just an easy cop out. Like, no.

Joe: 25:20

It actually doesn't depend. Yeah. There are specific things. Like, I'm gonna do a, you know, I'm gonna do a lying leg curl on a partial range of motion because we have a superior hamstring strain.

Jacob: 25:31

Mhmm.

Joe: 25:31

Right? Like, there has to be reasoning behind what we do. Right. That's what I think Sam is really cool about being like is like, hey, I do this because this works for me.

Jacob: 25:39

Yeah.

Joe: 25:39

Like, what was he talking about the other day? Was it maybe like condiments where he's just like, I could care

Jacob: 25:47

less about I think it is. Yeah.

Joe: 25:49

If I'm worried about these 20 calories that are in this mayo Yeah. I've got bigger problems. Yeah.

Jacob: 25:53

Because, like, he had think he was he was buying, like, canned chicken or something, and he was Yeah. Like, the comments were, like, I don't know, saying, like, how you have to eat it plain. He's like, no. I'm putting stuff on. Yeah.

Jacob: 26:03

Like, it's canned chicken or something like that.

Joe: 26:04

Saw that. We're in the grocery store. He's picking them all up.

Jacob: 26:06

Yeah. He's yeah. It's a lot of lot of protein in there. So

Joe: 26:10

He he's funny too. I mean, he's got that dry sense of humor.

Jacob: 26:13

He he kind of kinda going back to, like, how bodybuilding isn't as not as popular, but he's kind of bringing it. So he's connecting, like, insta like, casual Instagram users to, like, the real world of bodybuilding. So he's kinda bridging that gap.

Joe: 26:25

There's so many people that know who he is. Yeah. Joe Rogan was just talking about him. Yeah. And they're like, oh, do you know this guy?

Joe: 26:30

He's like, no. And then he saw a picture of him. He's like, oh, I've seen that guy before.

Jacob: 26:33

Him I think him and Sebum are really, really trying to bring bodybuilding back to the, you know, mainstream.

Joe: 26:39

Chris is a legend too. He's a I remember following him before he won an Arnold.

Jacob: 26:43

He's very down to earth too.

Joe: 26:44

He's a nice dude.

Jacob: 26:45

Yeah. Just seems so relaxed when he's lifting, like, just straight stone cold face, not Yeah. Not doing anything wild. It's Yeah.

Joe: 26:51

Some of that realm has just changed so much. Yeah. Now I don't do a ton of bodybuilding training anymore because it's just not functional in my opinion.

Jacob: 26:57

Yeah. Yeah.

Joe: 26:58

Now if you wanna train like that, go right ahead. It doesn't

Jacob: 27:00

I I will say I'm probably when my girlfriend is gonna plan on doing a show because she graduates in December from PA school. And then I think next January, she's gonna start training for a show. And I told her I'd train with her.

Joe: 27:12

So For the show?

Jacob: 27:13

Yeah. I'm not gonna do a show, but I'd I'd I'd hop on. I don't know how the diet's gonna go because I'm a I'm a foodie. I like to eat food. So

Joe: 27:20

There's something that and this is something that fascinates me. Like, I have a nutrition certification

Jacob: 27:26

Okay.

Joe: 27:26

As a physical therapist. There is so much mental grind that you go through

Jacob: 27:32

Mhmm.

Joe: 27:32

To prepare for a show Mhmm. Whether you're bulking. Yeah. Whether you're running a marathon, finishing an Ironman

Jacob: 27:38

Yeah.

Joe: 27:38

Running a hundred mile race. Yeah. There is so much mental games that you have to play with yourself to stay focused and be able to get to the finish line

Jacob: 27:46

Mhmm.

Joe: 27:46

That I don't think people appreciate.

Jacob: 27:48

Yeah. Oh, gosh. Yeah. It's like the what? I'm blanking on his name.

Jacob: 27:53

The the guy who has the dead lifting record. Dead at 500 five zero one kilograms. Eric Hall, is it? Oh, Eddie Hall? Eddie Hall.

Jacob: 28:07

The shorter I think so.

Joe: 28:09

Strong man guy?

Jacob: 28:09

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. When he broke the record, he made up a scenario where, like, if he doesn't lift that bar, his family will die.

Jacob: 28:15

And he trained like that for months, and that's how he, like, got to it. Like, the mental component is absolutely

Joe: 28:20

He has to go to a deep, dark place at some point

Jacob: 28:23

Yeah.

Joe: 28:23

That I even think that you know? And I talked about this last year. It's a little bit of the the freedom fitness challenge. And I really think this way now. You have to do something in your life that sucks.

Jacob: 28:36

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Joe: 28:37

At some point.

Jacob: 28:38

I like that.

Joe: 28:39

Yeah. You have to do something that sucks. Mhmm. Most people are too comfortable. Yep.

Joe: 28:43

And then that your your your paradigm shift just gets less and less and less that you wake up late for work and you think this is the worst thing ever. No. Right.

Jacob: 28:51

No. No perspective.

Joe: 28:52

No. It can get much much much worse. Yeah. Where if you prepare yourself for that stuff, it kinda sets you up for success down the

Jacob: 28:58

road. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. And that, I mean, that kind of wraps all the way back down to PT and just being able to educate the patient and talk to and and assure them that, you know, it it will get better eventually.

Jacob: 29:09

And it it with your hard work and, you know, what we're doing in the clinic, it it it will get better.

Joe: 29:14

Does your does your girlfriend, does she have to pay for training and nutrition and all that stuff?

Jacob: 29:19

No. I think she Or she

Joe: 29:20

do it all herself?

Jacob: 29:21

She has a trainer where she her gym she goes to, the gym owner, trained her. And I can't remember if she paid or not.

Joe: 29:28

Where does she train?

Jacob: 29:28

Down in Iowa, the Delves.

Joe: 29:31

So Is that a bike building gym? Yeah. I don't even know those still existed.

Jacob: 29:35

Yeah. I mean, like, Animal House in Brookfield. Have you ever been to Animal House? Or, like, New Berlin, honestly.

Joe: 29:39

Isn't that by I know where it is, but I've never been there.

Jacob: 29:42

Like, an industrial zone.

Joe: 29:44

It's off in Moreland, isn't it?

Jacob: 29:45

Yeah. So that's why I like to go there a lot. But it's it's I know where

Joe: 29:49

it is, but now I've never been in there. It's it's Isn't there one in Waukesha too? Or there was?

Jacob: 29:54

Yeah. There was, I think.

Joe: 29:55

Don't know if it's still open or not, though.

Jacob: 29:57

I don't know.

Joe: 29:58

I just have no interest in ever going back to a commercial gym.

Jacob: 30:01

Yeah. There's there's crunch opened up in Waukeshawn. It's it's a big gym, but it's

Joe: 30:05

it's Is that the one at the old Experience Fitness?

Jacob: 30:07

Yeah.

Joe: 30:07

Is that where you train at?

Jacob: 30:08

Mm-mm. I just go to the Y, unfortunately, but I try to go out of my house when I can. So

Joe: 30:14

I I don't I mean, I kinda know where it is, but I've never been there.

Jacob: 30:16

I mean Yeah.

Joe: 30:17

I love those environments where you just train hard and and and let it let it snap a little bit.

Jacob: 30:22

Everyone's supportive of you. They're all saying hi. The owner has a bunch of dogs that just hang out in the behind the counter. It's awesome.

Joe: 30:28

How much is it a month to go there? I don't even know, like, what to guess anymore to go to a gym.

Jacob: 30:31

60 or 70. I don't I'd pay I either pay daily, which is $9, or I buy, a punch card for, like, 50.

Joe: 30:38

So So you get x amount of workouts? Yeah.

Jacob: 30:40

Yeah. So just because of, you know, time, distance.

Joe: 30:43

Yeah. Yeah.

Jacob: 30:43

But, yeah, those I like those types of gyms. So

Joe: 30:48

Jacob, is there anything else you want us to know about you? Well, actually, there is. I'm gonna assume. I know we talked about this a little bit already of, you know, you like to work out. Yeah.

Joe: 30:58

I'm gonna assume that you don't sit at home and look at PT research twenty four seven.

Jacob: 31:02

No. I do not.

Joe: 31:03

Outside of working out too, what are some other things that you like to do that, you know, kinda represent your personality?

Jacob: 31:09

Like to watch the packers as much as it disappoints me. They they're a team that you can always root for, but they disappoint. I like to play pickleball. I like to fish, you know, bass, pike, all that stuff. Play video games.

Jacob: 31:23

Just a chill guy.

Joe: 31:25

Easy dude. Yeah. Easy dude. Yeah. Jacob, thanks for sitting

Jacob: 31:27

Yeah. No. That's it.

Joe: 31:28

Is that it? Yeah. Thanks for sitting down with us.

Jacob: 31:30

Sounds good. Thank you. Thanks for having me.

Joe: 31:32

If anybody is interested in seeing Jacob or anybody that knows somebody that you know would be a good fit with Jacob, all therapists here at Freedom are really good. He is in Grafton and Fox Pointe and obviously we also still have our Brookfield and Mogwonago locations but if you're looking to see Jacob, he will be in Fox Point or Grafton. So thanks for listening everybody to yet another episode of the Freedom Talks podcast, and we'll see everybody in the next couple weeks. Thanks, Jacob.

Jacob: 31:58

Thank you.